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She prefers the neutral English genre, "the conductor", to tell us about her job as conductor, to which she is now fully committed, backed by a solid profession, flawless organization and a good dose of positive energy. Present on the international stage, on the podiums of the great orchestral phalanges, the young thirty-something Lucie Leguay intends to tackle all repertoires, including opera, which she particularly cherishes, and today's music, which is an integral part of her training, her practice and her reputation. She looks back on a dazzling start to her career and a no less exciting present, invited to perform at the Casa da Música in Porto and the Cité de la Musique in Paris for a rather original concert of creations.
You were assistant conductor for five training courses between 2019 and 2021; then appointed assistant to Mikko Franck in 2021, with whom you are still working this year. How do you see your career today?
I was appointed assistant to the Orchestre de Lille, the ONDIF (Orchestre National d'Île de France), Picardie and the Verbier Festival all in the same year! I didn't expect to be asked to work with theEnsemble Intercontemporain (EIC) a few months later, an invitation I was quick to accept, of course. The task was a heavy one, but oh so rewarding, for I came to understand from Matthias Pintscher that contemporary music is conducted in the same way as repertoire music, with precision of detail, of course, but also the presence of color and phrasing. My familiar contacts with symphonic and operatic music nurtured this approach to contemporary writing, which in turn helped me to hear the music of the past in a different way. I already had the opportunity to conduct in France and abroad at that time, invitations which are multiplying today and which I can honor with greater availability: like this opera project next March with the Paris Conservatoire, Johann Strauss's Die Fledermaus , which I'm delighted about. I also work a lot with Germany, Amsterdam and the Brussels Philharmonic; I recently collaborated with the Orchestre de Strasbourg; I'll be in Bordeaux in 2023; and I've forged partnerships with the Munich and Buenos Aires orchestras. Since my time at the EIC, I've been called on a lot for contemporary music projects, in Geneva with the Lemanic Ensemble and Contrechamps, and in Frankfurt with Ensemble Modern. But I want to be active on all fronts, conducting all kinds of music and, above all, remaining open to new repertoires.
You have just assisted Matthias Pintscher in Wolfgang Rihm's Tutuguri; I believe this was your last collaboration with him? Tell us about working with him. What did you learn from it?
Contemporary music has always been part of my training, whether with Peter Eötvös and his master classes in Budapest, with Jean-Sébastien Béreau with whom I worked for almost ten years, or with my conducting teacher at the Haute-École de Musique de Lausanne. My two and a half years at the EIC introduced me to a huge repertoire, especially during the Covid period when I was often called upon to replace absent conductors at the drop of a hat; I absorbed an enormous amount of contemporary music and learned a great deal from the EIC musicians and Matthias Pintscher. The positive energy and enthusiasm he exudes, the way he works, the way he guides musicians in sound and color are all notions I share with him. Matthias Pintscher is a very important encounter in my career.
The conductor's position is certainly not the same when faced with an ensemble or an orchestra...
It obviously changes radically, first and foremost in terms of relationships with the musicians. I've been able to forge special bonds with each of the EIC soloists, which is more complicated with a symphony orchestra, especially as guest conductor. But I like both experiences. Just after the confinement, I did a crazy project with the Intercontemporain that really brought us together: the world premiere of twenty pieces commissioned from as many composers during a period of great distress, which put a smile on everyone's face.
Qhat role does contemporary music play in your career as a conductor?
If I'm invited back by an orchestra, as is the case with the Orchestre de Bretagne, I like to propose a contemporary piece as part of the program we decide together. The Brussels Philharmonic didn't hesitate to include a work by a young Flemish composer in the concert I'm about to conduct, knowing my experience in this field. And I'm looking forward to defending new works with these major phalanges, which are sometimes a little cautious about them. I have fond memories of my concert with the Orchestre de Strasbourg, Silence(s), presented by Clément Lebrun for children, where repertoires and styles came together with real joy. Between Brahms and Ravel, I conducted four works of contemporary music, including a premiere!
You will be conducting the Ensemble Intercontemporain on January 26 at the Philharmonie de Paris, where a new work by Catalan composer Hèctor Parra, La mort i la primavera for two ensembles and two conductors, will be featured. Is this a composer with whom you've already collaborated?
This is the very first time I've conducted his music, and it's always a joy for me to come into contact with a composer and his world of sound. He was there at the first rehearsal to introduce us to his piece, tell us the story behind it - a story taken from the novel by Catalan writer Mercè Rodoreda - and bring us closer to his sound project. The next day, he was off to Porto to repeat the same presentation with the Remix Ensemble and Peter Rundel, who was conducting with me. We took the time to work on the colors, the bowing positions for the strings, the balances and the spirit of the piece. He was delighted with this first reading, already satisfied with the sound result. One senses a real connivance with musicians he knows well and for whom he has written. In his score, the woodwinds (flute, oboe and clarinet) are given pride of place in an evocation of nature; he himself gives the musicians images of flowers opening. The writing is very detailed, at the service of the timbre he wants to hear. And in fact, when I was reading it, while working at the table, I already had music singing in my head. Hèctor Parra compares polyphony to muscular tissue deploying physical energy, and likens the movement of his music to dancing bodies. La mort i la primavera is subtitled ballet imaginaire.
How long does it take to prepare such a score?
I got the score at the end of December; I worked on it for a week at the end of the year and then for two weeks afterwards; I needed to assimilate this abundant writing and master its overall form as well as its structure, which must take into account the score of the other ensemble. We can have overlapping measures and tempi; this is an added difficulty, requiring great precision in my part and perfect synchronization between the two.
From a practical point of view, how do you work beforehand?
First of all, it's very important to work at the table, annotating the score to better visualize the musical discourse. First of all, I indicate the carrures, i.e. the articulation of successive musical phrases; I note the beats above the staves, roughly in the Boulézian manner handed down to me by Jean-Sébastien Béreau; I write down the bow strokes for the strings, the entrances for each section, everything I need to convey through my gestures.
Do you ever go to the piano?
I did go to the piano for La mort i la primavera , in order to grasp the harmonic dimension of the writing that holds the architectural edifice together.
You began your career as a director with Jean-Sébastien Béreau, a personality who has meant a great deal to you. How did you come to meet him?
When I met him, he was 71 years old, giving lessons in Lille where I was studying piano. He had taught at the Conservatoire National Supérieur de Musique de Paris for many years. He was the one who gave me the opportunity to work with an orchestra, rather than two pianos as is often the case in conducting studies. We worked together for three or four years, but I developed a very strong bond with him. He now lives in Portugal, where he has founded a conducting academy in Leiria. That's where I went every summer, for almost ten years, to continue following his advice. He passed on to me the heritage of French music.
Let's talk about your other mentors. Did you ever meet Pierre Boulez?
Sadly, no. I often ask EIC musicians to share their memories of working with the master, as there are few audio testimonies of his conducting practice. After my training with J.S.Béreau, I met Aurélien Azan Zielinski at the Haute École de Musique de Lausanne during my master's degree in conducting. I couldn't have found a personality more different from that of J.S. Béreau. He opened up new horizons for me; I discovered and developed other things, other ways of thinking about music and gesture in space, of managing my relationship with musicians. Then, as an assistant, at the Verbier Festival in particular, I received advice from Valery Gergiev, Daniel Harding, Klaus Mäkelä and Antonio Pappano. It only lasted a week, but I learned a lot, if only by watching them conduct. I also have boundless admiration for Simon Rattle's style, which I was able to immerse myself in via the Berliner Philharmoniker's Digital Konzert Hall. His work with the string section in particular is admirable.
What ties you to the orchestra?
I love sharing with musicians. It's something I missed as a pianist, even though I practiced chamber music. Ever since my junior high school years, when I was in special classes, I've felt frustrated at not being able to join the orchestra and be with the others. And when I was given the opportunity to play the piano in an orchestra for the first time, I felt this vibrancy and energy that made me want to conduct. I love the idea of changing phalanxes, from one week to the next, from one venue to another, to discover new talents and new sounds at each engagement.
What was your first experience as a chef?
I'll never forget it! I was 18, at nine o'clock on a Sunday morning, in Jean-Sébastien Béreau's class, with Beethoven's Symphony n°2 on the music stand. I discovered this extraordinary way of creating sound without touching the instrument, of feeling through my gesture the possibility of shaping sound. I had truly found my calling.
You won the Tremplin des jeunes cheffes at the Philharmonie in 2018; what do you think of the La Maestra competition launched in 2020?
First of all, I'd like to come back to the "Tremplin" competition, which I didn't really want to enter. I have a completely different conception of parity, even if I can only approve of this initiative and this impetus towards women, who have remained on the sidelines for too long. The presence on the jury of a large number of venue managers ready to put female chefs on the podium convinced me to sign up, to meet and convince them. Indeed, winning the competition generated a lot of invitations at a time when I was already very busy with my assistant jobs. It really launched my career. I was also chosen for the web series "chef.fe" initiated by the Philharmonie, which followed me on five projects, highlighting the profession of conductor, often little known to the general public. But I refused to take part in the Maestra competition , feeling sorry for male colleagues my age who are now, in turn, being neglected! We need to keep things in perspective and feel that we are chosen not for our gender, but for our merit and personality. This has led me to turn down certain projects that didn't have this requirement.
Do you feel that things have changed in terms of women's place on the podium?
Definitely. I'd say that the presence of a woman at the head of an orchestra has almost become normal, at least that's how I feel. The same goes for female composers. But we must remain vigilant and first evaluate skills before talking about gender.
Are you aware that you are a role model for the next generation of chefs?
I can tell you that I didn't need any female role models to do this job. But I am aware that the presence of women at the head of an orchestra today can awaken vocations. I worked with the Demos orchestra in Lille, where the children had two conductors, Alexandre Bloch, current director of the Lille Orchestra, and myself. I think it's a good idea to show children, both boys and girls, that the profession of conductor is a mixed one. The image is important to convey.
You founded the Lille Chamber Orchestra in 2014? It's a phalanx to which you've been attached, and which has enabled you to experiment in a number of ways, notably by crossing repertoires, imagining other concert formats and meeting other audiences. Is this a mission you intend to pursue?
I learned a lot through this project, in which I was in charge of everything: administration, treasury, production, direction, etc. The covid came to a halt in the summer of 2005. But covid brought our activity to a screeching halt, and I have to say that I haven't had the time to devote to it since. If things pick up again, which I hope they will, I'll need other financial resources to be able to delegate responsibilities.
What is your current dream as a conductor?
There are many: doing a grand opera by Strauss or a symphony by Brahms, or a ballet by Stravinsky, with the dancers on stage...
Interview by Michèle Tosi
Du simple au double" concert, Wednesday January 26 at the Philharmonie de Paris;
Watch Camille Ducellier's documentaries, here
